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  1. Wow!

    Thank you so much for putting that out there.
    What a touching, heart-felt, genuine interview.

    Blown away.

  2. Incredible! Shame in both mission presidents. But……. encourage Madeleine to allow Jamie to finish her thoughts/responses before she (Madeleine) interrupts if you invite them back.

  3. Madeleine and Jaime….

    I love your story and am so grateful to learn about your courageous journey. I’m so sorry for the traumatic and shameful treatment you were both made to go through on your missions. Your situation is a perfect example of how shameful the worthiness interviews are. It is also a crazy reality about leader roulette in how one Bishop or Stake President can handle a worthiness interview and the confession process, and yet another Bishop or Stake President can handle the confession process so inappropriately.

    I was glad to hear that you are going to therapy. The two of you are young and beautiful and have a great future ahead of you to enjoy. And your ongoing joy will be so much greater since you figured this all out while you are young instead of living a conflicted life for decades. I wish the church would create a therapeutic education fund to pay for all of the trauma and shame it has brought on people with individual cases that are so varied and different. How cool would it be for the church to admit that religious transitions have caused severe depression, sadness, divorces, and even suicide? How cool would it be for the church to defer a few million dollars each year out of the $32 Billion on the stock market to help people that have found themselves in a faith/personal crisis and to use the money to seek appropriate therapy rather than to be harassed by Priesthood Leaders that don’t have a clue. It will never happen, but one can dream!

    It is interviews like this that make it so important to financially support Mormon Stories and other podcasts that get the messaging out there about the Mormon Church. Thank you John for what you are doing and for bringing so many different stories to light.

    Good luck to you Madeleine and Jaime! I hope you have a great and happy life together. You have helped a lot of people today with this interview.

  4. Jamie and Madeleine, your love story—the love you have for each other and for your authentic selves—inspired me and gave me hope for the world in which my children are growing up. Madeleine’s beautiful, intense integrity and open-mindedness are a great example of the “fruits” of LGBTQ parents (to use an LDS phrase). I loved hearing how the two of you were drawn to each other as human beings, not as boy and girl or priesthood holder and whatever the female counterpart to that is supposed to be. I loved how this made it a non-issue for Madeleine to learn that Jamie felt compelled to begin identifying openly as a trans woman.

    You have both been through so much in your short lives, and you’ve used it to make you stronger and to build up the people and community around you. Utah needs people like you, and I hope you continue your activism of love. I wish you all the best and hope you can come back on Mormon Stories to discuss more about Jamie’s transition, about how parents and family can support non-gender-binary paradigms in a practical way, and about how feminist/women’s empowerment groups can do a better job of integrating the LGBTQ community. Thank you for sharing in such a vulnerable and powerful way!

  5. I have only listened to part 1 so far, but I am so moved by this story. The authenticity is so beautiful. I have not had such a good experience being authentic and I feel that I need to hide my queerness.

  6. I love these two so very much!!! Jaime reminds me of my tender nephew that committed suicide because of not fitting into this world. My heart is full of mixed emotions as I listen to the unbelievably sad hard things these two went through. That they seem so genuinely at peace and happy with being themselves now. How I hope there is just one young person who see’s this that felt like my nephew and finds encouragement to find a safe healthy space to live like these two beautiful people!
    Thank you for your interview. It was beautiful!

  7. This interview is blowing my mind. Beautiful. You can hear the heart <3 I love how comfortable you were always able to be with each other and how gender wasn’t a defining part of your relationship. True love, transcendent of society in a lot of ways.
    This is a question about all of the podcasts. Do you have a list of song credits for songs that play in between portions of the episode? There have been some good ones on all of these.

  8. The honesty expressed by these two is powerful stuff indeed. Others have already expressed most of the feelings this interview evoked in me so I will add just this. The good news is LDS Inc. has nothing to do with God and your personal relationship with the almighty is every bit as valid, in fact more so, than the pious jerks who claim to have authority over others. The bad news is LDS Inc. continues to mishandle and abuse those who put personal integrity above the sanctimonious pronouncements of those archaic hypocrites who stand at its’ head. Thanks John for continuing to shine the bright light of day into the dark recesses of this dishonest and secretive organization.

  9. I loved hearing your story. A suggestion to Madeiline, would be to let Jaime finish her sentences. You may not notice it much, but you cut her off all the time., and it was kind of distracting and frustrating.

    Much love to you both! Thanks for sharing your story.

  10. I was sent home early from a mission back in 1990 and the memory of the ride home from the airport is still so vivid. I cried along with you as you told your story, Madeleine. I wasn’t sent home for “worthiness” reasons but my mission experience was horrible and involved emotional abuse and gaslighting which had long-lasting impact. That feeling of being told to pack and that I’d be on a plane the next day…. Not being able to teach at the MTC, which had been a dream of mine, and not being able to fulfill my calling because of circumstances that were confusing and outside my control, caused grief that continued into my early marriage. I was still having actual dreams (when I was sleeping) that I was going to go back, even after my first child was born. I dreamed once that I was going to be leaving her and my husband to go back. There was a deep subconscious shame for having never finished my mission, but the experience also made me a more realistic and compassionate person, and gave me a deep empathy for vitims of emotional abuse. I’ve been able to help many people because, once I had healed from my experience, I could recognize and name what was happening to others. Thank you both for sharing your stories. I cried along with you, but also am so happy for the beautiful life you share no and the example you are setting for others.

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